Line Out - Comments on Snakes on a Bill http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill The science and jockeying involved in putting together a good bill can be intricate and thorny. Ask any booker, promoter, DJ, or musician. Positioning on that bill is important. Who’s going to open? Who’s going to play last? Is it... Copyright 2008 Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:00:46 -0800 Fri, 20 Jul 2007 17:04:56 -0800 http://www.movabletype.org/?v=3.34 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Comment by Eric whenever this happens, it's almost always when their band sucks and yours doesn't.
in this almost worst case scenario, you bite the bullet and play a killer set anyway. remember, there will be other shows and you never have to play with that band again.
another lame-o situation is when you show up knowing you are headlining, dude-who-set-up-the-show's band is also on the bill, he pulls the old "no, we actually had you guys opening, remember?" bit, and gets all passive aggressive about it. another total douchebag move. if you've saved your emails/phone messages, or you have a copy of the contract (and you always should) you can prove the guy wrong in front of everyone and you'll get the "oh wow, man. sorry, yeah, i don't know how that whole mixup happened" bit.

]]> Eric http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765523 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765523 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:50:16 -0800 Comment by Whatevs My favorite is when they pull out the old: "No, your band is listed at the top of the flyer, that means you are opening."

]]> Whatevs http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765525 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765525 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 13:56:19 -0800 Comment by Levislade Since when does anyone want to "headline" in this town? In my experience they just call it "playing last," and nobody wants it. I usually end up in the kind of situation where everyone's far too polite to actually say when they would prefer to play, "really, whatever's cool with you, although we'd rather not go last . . . or first . . ."

]]> Levislade http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765528 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765528 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:02:04 -0800 Comment by Plasmatic Eric @ 1 is dead on.

I have shown "dude-who-set-up-the-show" the chain of emails after he tried to snake and he said exactly that:

"oh wow, man. sorry, yeah, i don't know how that whole mixup happened."

Trent is right, you want to bitch to someone, but you don't want to piss off the club.

Sometimes you just want to shit in dude-who-set-up-the-show's guitar case, but that's not very nice.

]]> Plasmatic http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765535 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765535 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:09:29 -0800 Comment by Whatevs Another gem: "Our drummer has to work in the morning, would you mind headlining?"

Listen up fuck snaps, EVERYBODY has to work in the morning.

]]> Whatevs http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765566 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765566 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:44:34 -0800 Comment by Jason Josephes #5: I get that one a lot. The Blue Moon is a bit different in that I book AND do the sound and yet still there's the occasional miscommunication. My favorite is when a show has been booked for a couple of months, a band shows up, and then asks if they can switch slots.

Hell, I had a band last week that knew they were playing at 9PM. Most of the band finally showed up at 8:40. "We're playing at 9," they said. I mean, that's late for nine, but at least they showed. Nine rolls around and their keyboard player isn't here. He's at practice with his other band. He finally shows, but gets mad when I cut the band off after about 25 minutes. Thursdays we cut the live music at midnight, so I can't go delaying the whole night because somebody didn't have their act together.

]]> Jason Josephes http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765580 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765580 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:53:13 -0800 Comment by sam what do you do?
this is what most bands do:
play a lifeless, dull set, then spend the rest of the night in the corner sulking like little babies.

]]> sam http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765587 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765587 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:00:07 -0800 Comment by trent moorman "Fuck snaps", that is beautiful, Whatevs. Can I use that?

And Jason, they showed up 20 minutes before they were supposed to start, then got pissed when you cut them short. Classic. What fuck snaps.

I like when a band gets added on last minute to bill, then plays the same song for 50 minutes.

]]> trent moorman http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765597 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765597 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:04:22 -0800 Comment by Hernandez @3 Right on, man. Playing last kind of sucks, specially when venues attempt to cram an insane number of bands on a single bill.

]]> Hernandez http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765604 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765604 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:11:47 -0800 Comment by Whatevs Fuck snaps is in the common street vernacular of today's youth. Use it any way you like.

I'm not blowing him or anything, but Jason Josephe's Blue Moon music blog is the funniest shit on the internet.

]]> Whatevs http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765641 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765641 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:40:25 -0800 Comment by Jason Josephes Yeah, I gotta update that soon. Thanks for the shoutout!

]]> Jason Josephes http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765714 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765714 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:26:22 -0800 Comment by Abe another great topic Trent, thanks.


I agree with #1. Click "print" and bring it with, email the booker confirming the details if you have to, and don't wait until day of the show.

]]> Abe http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765772 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765772 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 17:53:21 -0800 Comment by Jason Josephes Traditional listing order, top to bottom, is last band to first. Who doesn't know that?

]]> Jason Josephes http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765852 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765852 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 21:50:20 -0800 Comment by Retha Yes, yes, yes. The snakes. They will snake. How many times I wished I had a print out of the way the show was oringinally set up.

Another element to add to this mix:

The manager.

The manager can be the bad guy and go deal with the snakes and deuches and dick head ass hole sound guys.

But it is best to have a nice manager. True, you don't want to piss off the club.

Anyone know where to find good managers?

]]> Retha http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765872 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765872 Sound Check Wed, 18 Jul 2007 23:17:49 -0800 Comment by MattyDread Easy: play first, kick ass, take a long time breaking down.

I've usually had it the other way, when I'm supposed to be in the opening act but the other act sucks ass and they know everybody's there to see us so they pull the switch and try to play first. Kind of annoying for the "early in the morning" fans, but by now people know that schedules are basically made up on the spot.

The one that kills me is when a band that wasn't on the bill somehow pulls strings to get added at the last minute, sets up to play first, takes forever to get on stage, sucks, ignores the soundguy's requests to get off, and ends up cutting your set short, and then doesn't even stick around for your set. You have no recourse.

Amen to #3--it's not headlining, it's playing last. Unless you actually have a lot of fans and are playing a decent venue on a good night.

]]> MattyDread http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765955 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765955 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 09:40:06 -0800 Comment by Tante We are Americans. The band, the manager, the supervisor, doesn't matter who but the first thing to do when things go wrong is find blame. Fix blame. Fix blame fast. Who caused Katrina? Sadam?Bomb Iraq.
In this the age of immediate communication, it seems each band would confirm line up with all parties and whene confirmd line up. Send confirmed line out to this blog. it gets snaked, which it will, set up fast while handing out the confirmed line up jst to make yiourself feel better when breaking your back to double time set up. Send confirmed list to this blog. Count the number of Seattle snakes, keep it posted. Send Jason a copy tooooo don't we love the Blue Moon Bloggers.

]]> Tante http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765958 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c765958 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 09:46:30 -0800 Comment by You know it My favorite 70s band in Seattle has perfected the art of the eternal set up, play a long set, and then dissappear right afterward while their gear remains on stage.

Tick tock kids, the ironic 70s kitch is wearing thin. better trade those american flags for synths.

]]> You know it http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766058 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766058 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:05:05 -0800 Comment by godsactionfigure Bands who pull crap like that are never booked again in my bar.

]]> godsactionfigure http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766078 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766078 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:26:05 -0800 Comment by Rick Thumbs up to Jason at Blue Moon for holding bands accountable. That is key.. bands definitely have a responsibility to make sure those kinds of details (including the split of the $$) are agreed upon beforehand; and printing those emails is a good idea. (God, anyone remember doing this before email and myspace were so prevalent?? It's so easy now to be in contact with the bands you're playing with, these fuck ups should be way less common.)

But, someone at the venue has to be running the show and enforcing set times. Usually it's the sound guy b/c the booker is not around. But left to their own ego-driven devices, even the coolest band will sometimes push the set length, pinching another band's time. Places like Sunset and Tractor always post the set times, so when the bands roll in, it's in writing from the venue. Makes the last minute switcheroo less likely.

Plus, just know something about the bands you're playing with.. go see 'em play before you jump on a bill with 'em. Offer to share bass rig and drums; makes everything go faster (and if you went to see them play you know whether the drummer is gonna pull a keith moon on your kit that he's sharing..)

I don't know when everyone got so pansy ass about playing last. Headliners play last. You earn that spot by having a strong draw that's not afraid to stay out late. If your crowd can't hang, then you're not a headliner. Just don't say you're the headliner, but demand middle slot, and run off with the biggest wad of cash at the end of the night. The 3rd band should anchor the bill; the venue wants to sell drinks 'til the end of the night, and the band whose job it is to make that happen should be compensated at least as well as the band with the cush middle slot.

And another thing...!!! See, ya got me all fired up...

]]> Rick http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766123 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766123 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 12:22:34 -0800 Comment by eric w. You guys are so negative!

Hey, if you thought you were playing second, but they tell you you are playing last- don't worry! After they lock the doors, you can do some blow with the sound guy!

]]> eric w. http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766304 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766304 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 15:43:05 -0800 Comment by D I rock my cock out no matter what.

I don't care when I play. Neither does my cock.

]]> D http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766341 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c766341 Sound Check Thu, 19 Jul 2007 16:30:46 -0800 Comment by Andrew C. I think its pretty rough to play last for anyone. I wish weekday shows started earlier like 7-8 ish and started ON TIME. that would take awau some of sting of opening. so many shows start late. We have always had a very good time playing Blue Moon and Jason is big part of that. so thanks Jason. Jules Maes is always on time, which helps also.

]]> Andrew C. http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c767009 http://lineout.thestranger.com/2007/07/snakes_on_a_bill#c767009 Sound Check Fri, 20 Jul 2007 17:04:56 -0800